If you've listened to this podcast at all recently, you'll know that I'm in the editing phase of the new book - the phase where we 'carve it into tiny pieces, throw significant chunks of it in the recycling (because words are never wasted and text storage is basically free) and rebuild the rest into something shinier, sharper and generally more succinct.' And I'm telling you this because this week's guest is a fellow writer who knows what it's like to stare at a blank page until your forehead bleeds - but in this case, she's also an academic psychologist who has the data to back up the value of Thrutopian writing. Dr Denise Baden is a Professor of Sustainable Practice at the University of Southampton, and she says, that 'working in sustainability and climate change, the more you know the scarier it is. Like the sun, you can’t look too closely at it, but face to one side, you make your way, because in fact, it’s easy to put everything right. All the solutions are right here, they just have to catch on. Walking lightly and mindfully upon the earth is so doable. I started writing as therapy, with green solutions as the main ingredient, stories to soothe my soul. Then my characters and their stories took over centre stage, leaving the green solutions to season the stew.'Denise is one of those people who sees a problem and starts creating real world solution. in 2018, she set up the series of free Green Stories writing competitions to inspire writers to create positive visions of what a sustainable society might look like, and to tell stories that showcase solutions, not just problems because her data show that's what we need. In the process she continued to research what works in terms of fiction and climate communication - as a result of which, she has written a novel, Habitat Man, and she compiled an anthology of short stories  called No More Fairy Tales: Stories to Save Our Planet. which she had ready by COP27 so there was a copy for every delegate to read. Magnificently, she is on the Forbes list of Climate Leaders: https://www.forbes.com/sites/solitairetownsend/2023/03/19/68-climate-leaders-changing-the-film-and-tv-industry/Denise Website https://www.dabaden.com/Green Stories website https://www.greenstories.org.uk/  NEXT NOVEL PRIZE DEADLINE IS 26th JUNEDenise on Twitter: https://twitter.com/DABadenauthorDenise publications and academic record https://www.southampton.ac.uk/people/5wzjrb/professor-denise-badenSustainable HairCare project: https://ecohairandbeauty.com/Details of the project with Bafta and Albert  https://www.greenstories.org.uk/climatecharacters/Key hashtags are #ClimateCHaracters and #HotOrNot. The survey is here (please go an complete it!)  bit.ly/433n71wThe images were designed by  https://www.rubberrepublic.com/ (check out their website – the first and third especially are hilarious and the one about the old XR protestor is incredibly moving. Thrutopia website https://thrutopia.lifeBooks mentioned by other authorsCarbon Diaries by Saci Lloyd https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/4935015-the-carbon-diaries-2015The Ministry for the Future by Kim Stanley Robinson https://uk.bookshop.org/p/books/the-ministry-for-the-future-kim-stanley-robinson/2164043

How do we really create systemic change? How do we shift narratives towards a generative future? How do we bring artists, scientists, policy makers, educators, conservationists, journalists, and all the different siloed tribes together in ways that let them genuinely communicate and listen to the web of life? This week's guest is someone who is actively working on so many levels to change all these things.  As you'll hear, Markus Reymann is a Director of a European Arts foundation, which doesn't sound nearly as exciting as it is. Because this is an arts foundation with a difference. TBA21 says of itself that it is a leading international art and advocacy foundation and it stewards the TBA21 Collection and its outreach activities, which include exhibitions, educational offers, and public programming. The TBA21–Academy, which Markus helped set up, is the foundation’s research center, 'fostering a deeper relationship with the Ocean and other bodies of water by working as an incubator for collaborative inquiry, artistic production, and environmental advocacy. For more than a decade, the Academy has catalyzed new forms of knowledge emerging from the exchanges between art, science, policy, and conservation in long-term and collaborative engagement through fellowships and residency programs. All activity at TBA21 is fundamentally driven by artists and the belief in art and culture as a carrier of social and environmental transformation.'  We talk a lot about social and environmental transformation on this podcast: it's what we're here for and what we believe is essential not just to creating that future we'd be proud to leave behind, but to creating any liveable future at all for most of the species on the planet.  We talk a lot, too, about systemic thinking, about paradigm shifts and about our capacity as a species to let go of our dominant narratives, and the need for someone, somewhere to bring together the scientists, the artists, the policy makers, the journalists, the educators…and do it in a way that breaks down the barriers, lets them actually understand each other - and then shows them other cultures that think differently, that have different value systems than ours ,so they can see that there are different ways of doing things that will work. And this, is what Markus is doing. Here is someone who understands systemic thinking and who is applying it with depth and breadth and great heart.  Bio: Markus Reymann is Director of TBA21–Academy, a non-profit cultural organization he co-founded in 2011 that fosters interdisciplinary dialogue and exchange surrounding the most urgent ecological, social, and economic issues facing our oceans today. Markus leads the Academy’s engagement with artists, activists, scientists, and policy-makers worldwide, resulting in the creation of new commissions, new bodies of knowledge, and new policies advancing the conservation and protection of the oceans. In March 2019, the Academy launched Ocean Space, a new global port for ocean literacy, research, and advocacy. Located in the restored Church of San Lorenzo in Venice, Italy, Ocean Space is activated by the itinerant Academy and its network of partners, including universities, NGOs, museums, government agencies, and research institutes from around the world.Reymann also serves as Chair of Alligator Head Foundation, the scientific partner of TBA21–Academy. Alligator Head Foundation established and maintains the East Portland Fish Sanctuary, and oversees a marine wet laboratory in Jamaica.TBA21 https://tba21.org/TBA21–Academy: https://tba21.org/tags/?tag=tba21_academyOcean Space in Venice https://tba21.org/tags/?tag=ocean_spaceWalid Raad https://www.walidraad.com/Anthropocene Observatory https://www.territorialagency.com/anthropoceneWoods Hole Oceanographic Observatory https://www.whoi.edu/

How did one man make the shift from Not wanting to live in this world, to refusing to live in this world?If you've listened to this podcast for any length of time, you'll know that I did the Masters in Regenerative Economics at Schumacher college in 2016-17.  It was a genuinely life changing experience not least because I met some of the most inspiring people I could imagine - young, motivated and incredibly bright. And of them all, Charlie was the brightest. Even before we met, he'd studied economics at Harvard and SOAS which for those of you not in academia, are both hardcore and supremely activist. And while doing the MA, he was acting as researcher for one of our best known non-fiction journalists and writers. What I didn't know was that he was already an award-winning activist who, over the course of his career has worked for the New Economics Foundation, the Royal Society of Arts, the Good Law Project, the Four Day Week Campaign and the Centre for Progressive Change, as well as the UK Labour Party under three consecutive leaders. Charlie has spoken at the LSE, the UN and the World Economic Forum and written for The Ecologist, The Independent, Novara Media, Open Democracy and The Guardian.I should have guessed most of that. What I perhaps also ought to have understood better was that he was bipolar - he now says of himself that he's proudly mad which I love - and how deeply it influenced who he was and what he did. So when he contacted me a while ago with news that he'd written a book, I wasn't remotely surprised. What was slightly surprising was that he is now a double amputee, and that his book is written about the interface between mental health, the climate emergency and what we now call eco-anxiety but which I think needs a rather stronger name than that implies. But definitely, this is something I wanted to talk about on the podcast - the edges to which our awareness of this time brings us, the frustration that arises out of living in a culture that still, broadly, gaslights all of us and does its best to rob us of the power to bring about change. Note that I don't think it's succeeding, and Charlie's book is a testament to the not-succeeding of the dominant culture, to the resilience of people around the world who are living with the reality of the climate, ecological and societal crisis and are forging paths through the chaos. Spinning Out: Climate Change, Mental Health and Fighting for a Better Future is an extraordinary book. It approaches head on the things we often turn away from, and we did this too, in the podcast - so this is a potential trigger warning. We do discuss Charlie's suicide attempt and how he ended up with two prosthetic legs, so if this is going to be hard for you, please tap into whatever are your resources before you listen. And then sit back and enjoy, because Charlie's brought his astonishing capacity for humanity, deep thought, and huge emotional intelligence to this and I loved it.Charlie's website https://charliehertzogyoung.cargo.site/Charlie on Linked In https://www.linkedin.com/in/charlie-hertzog-young-frsa-40b50b162/?originalSubdomain=ukCharlie's book, Spinning Out  https://footnotepress.com/product/spinning-out/Charlie at Hay on Wye https://www.hayfestival.com/p-20173-charlie-hertzog-young-and-mya-rose-craig-talk-to-areeba-hamid.aspx

Paddy and I recorded a brief 15 minute bonus of how the world could look if we actually employed all the strategies in 'Building Tomorrow' - so sit back, soak it in - and then let's make it happen... BIO: Author, Paddy le Flufy read mathematics at Cambridge, then - as seems to have happened with quite a lot of our recent guests, he took a job in the city and qualified as an accountant with KPMG. And then, as also seems to happen with our guests, he didn't buy into the system, but instead spent years, living a double life in which he worked as a finance specialist in London for six months of the year and then used the money to live in remote places, alongside people whose lives were radically different from his own. He has traveled with economic migrants, been taught to fish by the rural people of Mozambique and lived with Hadza hunter-gatherers. He spent two months living with an indigenous tribe in the Ama§on rainforest, then won a Royal Geographical Society Award to spend an entire year being taught by traditional wisdom-keepers from another jungle culture. Since 2015, he has been based in the UK and then Canada, researching how we can redesign our economic system to avert the impending environmental catastrophe. His book is the result and it brought together some ideas we've explored already on the podcast, but knits them with things I had never heard about, and it creates a whole that has the potential to change the way our culture functions - which is genuinely exciting. Paddy's website https://paddyleflufy.com Paddy on Linked In https://www.linkedin.com/in/paddy-le-flufy/Paddy on Substack https://paddyleflufy.substack.com Doughnut Economics https://doughnuteconomics.org/RiverSimple  https://www.riversimple.com/governance/Sovereign Money https://positivemoney.org/our-proposals/sovereign-money-introduction/FabLab https://www.fablabs.io/Curitiba Bus Tokens https://brazilianexperience.com/curitibas-bus-system-2/Cosmo-Localism https://www.thealternative.org.uk/dailyalternative/2019/5/13/what-is-cosmo-localism-and-why-we-think-its-a-game-changer

As you will know by now, this podcast searches long and hard for answers to the over-riding question of 'what do we need to do, to get us from where we are, to where we need to be to set the stage for that generative future our hearts know is possible?' So when I got a book that directly asked and then answered that question, I dived straight in. 'Building Tomorrow: Averting Environmental Crisis With a New Economic System' does exactly what it says on the cover. It's full of concrete examples of individuals, organisations and businesses who are forging new ground at the leading edge of change, weaved into a coherent imagining of a future that runs by different rules.Author, Paddy Le Flufy, read mathematics at Cambridge, then - as seems to have happened with quite a lot of our recent guests, he took a job in the city and qualified as an accountant with KPMG. And then, as also seems to happen with our guests, he didn't buy into the system, but instead spent years living something of a double life, earning money as a finance specialist in London then spending it living in remote places, alongside people whose lives were radically different from his own. This period culminated with a year, funded by a Royal Geographical Society Award, being taught by indigenous wisdom-keepers in the Peruvian Amazon. Since 2015, he has been based in the UK and then Canada, researching how we can redesign our economic system to avert the impending environmental catastrophe. His book is the result of this research. It brings together some ideas we've explored already on the podcast, but knits them with things I had never heard about, and it creates a whole that has the potential to change the way our culture functions - which is genuinely exciting. Paddy's website https://paddyleflufy.com  Building Tomorrow on Amazon https://www.amazon.co.uk/Building-Tomorrow-Averting-Environmental-Economic/dp/1739345207/ Paddy on Linked In https://www.linkedin.com/in/paddy-le-flufy/Paddy on Substack https://paddyleflufy.substack.com Paddy on Twitter www.twitter.com/paddyleflufy Doughnut Economics https://doughnuteconomics.org/RiverSimple  https://www.riversimple.com/governance/Sovereign Money https://positivemoney.org/our-proposals/sovereign-money-introduction/Fab Labs https://fabfoundation.org/  Torekes currency https://www.torekes.be/nl/home/ Cosmo-Localism https://www.thealternative.org.uk/dailyalternative/2019/5/13/what-is-cosmo-localism-and-why-we-think-its-a-game-changerThe Cosmolocal Reader https://clreader.net/