The Long Game with Jake Sullivan and Jon Finer

Anne Applebaum, Pulitzer Prize-winning author and staff writer at The Atlantic, joins Jake Sullivan and Jon Finer to discuss how far-right ideology and private profit have become intertwined in the Trump administration’s approach to the world; the subject of her new cover story for The Atlantic.

They also examine the opaque U.S. oil arrangements in Venezuela, the campaign for political influence in Greenland, and the difficult work of rebuilding American institutions and alliances after Trump.

For paid subscribers, Jake and Jon continue their conversation with Anne Applebaum. She details what changes to the White House and the Kennedy Center reveal about political power and culture in Washington.Subscribe to Long Game + on Apple or Substack for access and to support the show.

Access video versions of exclusive podcast segments, transcripts, and more on Substack: https://thelonggame.substack.com/

Watch the video version of this episode on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@podlonggame

Email Jake and Jon at longgame@voxmedia.com.

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The Long Game is produced by the Vox Media Podcast Network.

Photo Credit: Viktor Kovalchuk/Global Images Ukraine via Getty Images.
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PHOTO CREDIT

China experts Jessica Chen Weiss, David M. Lampton Professor of China Studies at Johns Hopkins SAIS, and Julian Gewirtz, fellow at Harvard’s Belfer Center and senior research scholar at Columbia University, join Jake Sullivan and Jon Finer ahead of Chinese President Xi Jinping’s state visit to Washington.

What does Xi hope to secure from President Trump—and what should the United States seek in return? Could the current truce become a durable détente, or is the relationship moving in two directions at once: greater stability at the top and deeper competition underneath? And as concern grows about advanced AI, can Washington and Beijing reduce the risks without resolving their fundamental distrust?

The conversation also examines Taiwan, rare-earth export controls, China’s expanding global role, and the choices that could shape the relationship long after this week’s summit.

For paid subscribers, Jake and Jon break down President Trump’s United Nations General Assembly speech in a special segment. Subscribe to Long Game + on Apple or Substack for access and to support the show.

Access video versions of exclusive podcast segments, transcripts, and more on Substack: https://thelonggame.substack.com/

Watch the video version of this episode on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@podlonggame

Email Jake and Jon at longgame@voxmedia.com.

Follow The Long Game so you never miss an episode. New episodes drop weekly.

The Long Game is produced by the Vox Media Podcast Network.

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Julia Curlee, a former CIA analyst and acting senior director at the National Security Council, joins Jake Sullivan and Jon Finer to explain why she believes America’s intelligence system is being weakened from within.

Curlee also discusses her experience briefing Vice President Mike Pence and why she left government after nearly 20 years. After the interview, Then to argue for and against reaching a deal with the U.S. and continuing Beijing’s open-weight strategy.

Access video versions of exclusive podcast segments, transcripts, and more on Substack: https://thelonggame.substack.com/

Watch the video version of this episode on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@podlonggame

Email Jake and Jon at longgame@voxmedia.com.

Follow The Long Game so you never miss an episode. New episodes drop weekly.

The Long Game is produced by the Vox Media Podcast Network.

Photo Credit : Julia Curlee
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25 Years After 9/11: Admiral McRaven’s Warning for America

Retired Admiral William H. McRaven, former commander of U.S. Special Operations Command and Joint Special Operations Command, joins Jake Sullivan and Jon Finer as the country marks the 25th anniversary of 9/11. McRaven recalls watching the attacks while recovering from a parachute accident, and later planning and executing the operation that brought Osama bin Laden to justice.

They also examine why the Trump administration’s unexplained removal of senior military leaders could weaken candid advice and military preparedness; how special operations must adapt from counterterrorism to competition with major powers; and why America’s alliances remain essential to its security.

Access video versions of exclusive podcast segments, transcripts, and more on Substack: https://thelonggame.substack.com/

Watch the video version of this episode on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@podlonggame

Email Jake and Jon at longgame@voxmedia.com.

Follow The Long Game so you never miss an episode. New episodes drop weekly.

The Long Game is produced by the Vox Media Podcast Network.

Photo credit: TSgt Rob Hazelett, PublicDomain
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Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent says the U.S. is entering “the endgame” with Iran, launching what he calls an “economic D-Day.” Closer to home, U.S.-Canada trade talks have collapsed after Prime Minister Mark Carney rejected Washington’s latest demands.

Jake Sullivan and Jon Finer examine whether Operation Economic Outcast can change Iran’s calculus, why China holds the key, and why Canadians are backing a trade fight they expect to hurt. They also stage a Red Team/Blue Team debate over President Trump’s new cyber memo, which allows private companies to conduct offensive operations against foreign cybercriminals. Jon makes the case for the so-called cyber privateers, while Jake lays out the risks.

Subscribe to The Long Game+ on Apple podcasts or on Substack for access to exclusive segments. This week, Jake and Jon tackle two listener questions: What should we make of CIA Director John Ratcliffe’s unannounced trip to Moscow? And, how did Jake and Jon manage the physical and mental toll of their years as national security advisors?

Video versions of exclusive podcast segments, transcripts, and more available on Substack: https://thelonggame.substack.com/

Watch the video version of this episode on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@podlonggame

Email Jake and Jon at longgame@voxmedia.com.

Follow The Long Game so you never miss an episode. New episodes drop weekly.

The Long Game is produced by the Vox Media Podcast Network.

Photo by ANDREJ IVANOV / AFP via Getty Images
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