Topline

Sam Slevin, Global SVP of Customer Success at AlphaSense, joins Sam Jacobs, AJ Bruno, and Asad Zaman on the AI-era customer success playbook. Topics include why service is the differentiator over the next 2 to 3 years, the case for customer success owning a revenue number from day one, the gap between finance's productivity targets and real-life capacity. Plus, the origins of customer success, why consumption-based pricing can quickly become a trap, and a bull-versus-bear debate on whether HubSpot can get back to a $20 billion market cap. In short... big episode!
Key Takeaways:
- After 17 years building customer success teams, Sam Slevin doesn't entertain the "should CS own a number" debate. As Sam Slevin, Global SVP of Customer Success at AlphaSense, put it: "in my 17 years of, of customer success and leadership within customer success, that has never actually been a debate for, for me. I, I would never take a role that doesn't have revenue focused and like impact owning a number, calling your forecast from day one." His standing practice when he joins a new company: build a top-down and bottoms-up forecast on day one and validate it the same way sales does.
- Slevin's central thesis is that AI raises the floor on automation while service becomes the upside lever for the next 2 to 3 years. As Slevin put it: "I don't think there could be a more exciting time to be in customer success where service feels like it could be the major differentiator over the next 2 to 3 years." The CS team that listens carefully, builds deep relationships, and meets customers where they are wins the renewal and the expansion.
- The hardest tension in CS productivity is the gap between what finance models demand and what individual accounts actually support. As Slevin put it on his approach: "I definitely want to increase productivity in ARR per AM. What's interesting is I feel like there's a finance model and then there's a real life model… finance will say we need $15 million per AM." The leader's job, Slevin argues, is to find the 10% operational drag (AM-to-AE handoffs, billing friction, segmentation gaps) and remove it to close the gap.
- On HubSpot's path back to $20 billion, AJ Bruno takes the bullish side based on customer behavior signals. As AJ Bruno, CEO at QuotaPath, put it: "And the fact that they've gone horizontal, um, now I know that there are like 70% of their customers are still looking for answers for HubSpot of what AI needs to look like, and they haven't let the opportunity yet pass them by, but it's getting shaky right now." Sam Jacobs took the bearish side, citing structural challenges and faster-moving AI-first competitors.
 
Connect with the Hosts & Guests:
Host: Sam Jacobs, CEO at Pavilion - https://www.linkedin.com/in/samfjacobs/
Host: AJ Bruno, CEO at QuotaPath - https://www.linkedin.com/in/ajbruno3/
Host: Asad Zaman, CEO at Sales Talent Agency - https://www.linkedin.com/in/azaman1/
Guest: Sam Slevin, Global SVP Customer Success at AlphaSense - https://www.linkedin.com/in/sam-slevin-9b2ba21b/
 
Topline is more than a YouTube Channel:
Subscribe to Topline Newsletter: https://toplinemedia.substack.com/
Tune into Topline Podcast, the #1 podcast for founders, operators, and investors in B2B tech: https://www.joinpavilion.com/topline-podcast
Join the free Topline Slack channel to connect with 600+ revenue leaders to keep the conversation going beyond the podcast: https://www.joinpavilion.com/topline-slack
Chapters:
00:00 Introducing Sam Slevin
03:13 Customer Success in the AI Era
04:28 Should CS Own a Number?
07:43 Gross Retention vs. Growth
11:02 The Number-Owner Premium
14:37 Service as the AI-Era Moat
22:19 Productivity Per Person
26:34 Vendor Spend and AI Voice Modes
35:12 Reimagining GTM Roles
38:51 Quiz Pro Quo
45:38 Seat to Usage-Based Pricing
50:12 Pricing AI Like a Meter
55:43 CSM vs Salesperson Comp Gap
58:43 Bulls and Bears

Ryan Burke, VP of Worldwide Sales at Crogl, joins Sam Jacobs, AJ Bruno, and Asad Zaman on the new economics of enterprise cyber risk. Topics include Anthropic's Mythos model, AI for the security operations center, why vibe-coded apps are far more likely to have security issues, why Claude Design tanked Figma's stock, and what the Elon Musk versus OpenAI lawsuit signals for AI governance.
Key takeaways:
AI has crashed the cost of running sophisticated attacks, putting nation-state-grade tooling in the hands of low-skill operators. As Ryan Burke, VP of Worldwide Sales at Crogl, put it on Anthropic's Mythos model: "Mythos has lowered the cost to like the dollar menu equivalent of...running an attack...so more people can do it." Enterprises are staring down a multi-year patching backlog that runs from now until the end of time.
Non-technical teams in finance, ops, and HR are shipping internal tools using Replit and Claude, and almost none of them are securing what they build. Ryan Burke flagged the research: "vibe-coded software is almost 3 times as likely to have security issues." When the employee who built the agent quits, the agent stays behind with no owner, no documentation, and quiet access to systems it never should have had in the first place.
For founders eyeing an exit, security has joined revenue, IP, and hitting your numbers as a non-negotiable diligence pillar. As Ryan Burke explained: "lack of security can kill an acquisition...a fourth pillar now is you're secure." Acquirers like JPMorgan Chase will not buy a fintech startup that turns into a vector for attackers to walk straight into their environment.
The market case for NRR-fortress legacy SaaS may be weaker than the last decade made it look. As Asad Zaman, CEO of Sales Talent Agency, argued: "there was a generation of software companies that had signs that they had really good customer relationships...but their customers felt more like prisoners." If AI makes switching cheap and a new generation of software actually delights users, the moats around system-of-record incumbents start to compress fast.
Connect with the hosts and guest: 
Host: Sam Jacobs, CEO at Pavilion - https://www.linkedin.com/in/samfjacobs/ 
Host: AJ Bruno, CEO at QuotaPath - https://www.linkedin.com/in/ajbruno3/ 
Host: Asad Zaman, CEO at Sales Talent Agency - https://www.linkedin.com/in/azaman1/ 

Guest: Ryan Burke, VP Worldwide Sales at Crogl - https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryan-burke-bos/
Topline is more than a YouTube Channel: 
Subscribe to Topline Newsletter: https://toplinemedia.substack.com/ 
Tune into Topline Podcast, the #1 podcast for founders, operators, and investors in B2B tech: https://www.joinpavilion.com/topline-podcast 
Join the free Topline Slack channel to connect with 600+ revenue leaders to keep the conversation going beyond the podcast: https://www.joinpavilion.com/topline-slack
Chapters: 
00:00 Introducing Ryan Burke
03:14 Anthropic Mythos and Cyber Risk
04:20 How Attackers Use AI at Scale 
07:00 Dollar Menu Attacks Explained 
10:41 AI for the Security Ops Center 
14:53 Why Claude Tanks Figma's Stock 
18:30 Sam's Advice on Falling Stocks 
20:50 Are Legacy SaaS Companies Back? 
24:04 The Vibe-Coding Risk Surface 
27:56 Quiz Pro: Cybersecurity Edition 
33:46 Replit Apps Inside Enterprises 
40:18 Security as the M&A Fourth Pillar 
44:17 Personal Data and Digital Legacy 
47:24 Bulls vs Bears: Elon vs OpenAI 
52:03 Will ServiceNow Hit $32B?

Stage 2 Capital General Partner Liz Christo joins the show to discuss the disconnect between venture expectations and reality in the software market. The conversation covers the hidden costs of the new build versus buy debate, the structural changes happening within modern sales organizations, and whether traditional B2B SaaS go-to-market strategies and moats still matter when AI coding tools make software replication cheaper than ever.
Key Takeaways:
-The shift toward building internal AI tools instead of buying SaaS products overlooks long-term technical debt, as Liz Christo points out that "there's like a huge amount of cost buried behind the scenes that we're not really talking about today because it's still like sexy and fun."
-Founders are artificially inflating their Total Addressable Market to meet new venture capital baseline expectations, with Liz Christo noting that "pitch decks read like really ridiculous right now where everybody wants to tell the story of like a $10 billion outcome because that's the new milestone that got set."
-Revenue Operations is becoming the most direct path to the Chief Revenue Officer seat in AI-first organizations, which Sam Jacobs explains is "because as we use fewer humans and more agents, the sort of the half technical, the semi-technical capabilities of most RevOps people will translate into orchestrating armies of agents."
-Delegating analysis and writing to AI risks destroying strategic judgment across go-to-market teams, a trend Liz Christo summarizes by stating, "I think we are producing an incredible amount of content that's not getting consumed... I just think we're like losing the ability to think and we're not teaching junior employees how to do it."
Connect with the Hosts & Guests:
Host: Sam Jacobs - https://www.linkedin.com/in/samfjacobs/ 
Host: AJ Bruno - https://www.linkedin.com/in/ajbruno3/ 
Host: Asad Zaman - https://www.linkedin.com/in/azaman1/ 
Guest: Liz Christo - https://www.linkedin.com/in/lizchristo/
 
Topline is more than a YouTube Channel:
Subscribe to Topline Newsletter: https://toplinemedia.substack.com/ Tune into Topline Podcast, the #1 podcast for founders, operators, and investors in B2B tech: https://www.joinpavilion.com/topline-podcast Join the free Topline Slack channel to connect with 600+ revenue leaders to keep the conversation going beyond the podcast: https://www.joinpavilion.com/topline-slack
 
Chapters: 
00:00 Intro and Cold Open
02:41 The New Build vs Buy Debate
06:10 Engineers in Every Department
10:48 Pitch Decks and 10B Dollar TAMs
17:53 Venture Capital Funding Quiz
23:43 AI Memos and Critical Thinking
42:41 Software Moats and Switching Costs
47:46 Bulls vs Bears Segment
48:23 RevOps as a Path to CRO
51:25 The Future of SDR Managers
55:14 Is Clay Actually Undervalued
59:12 Odds of Hitting 50M ARR

Peter Walker brings Carta's proprietary private market data from 60,000 startups and 85% of US unicorns to expose the brutal realities of today's tech landscape. While Q1 saw record capital raised, the money is highly concentrated among foundation models. We review the harsh truth behind the 530,000 open tech jobs in the US and the widening talent divide separating top 10% performers from the rest of the market. The conversation covers why venture capital is squeezing operators, how private equity is no longer a guaranteed exit strategy, and the urgent need to optimize your GTM strategy for AI-native workflows. We also debate the death of long-term product roadmaps, the impact of AI on enterprise pipeline generation, and evaluate whether middle management will survive the next 24 months.
Key Takeaways
The traditional safety net for slow-growth SaaS companies has disappeared, with Peter Walker noting that "A lot of companies held out this PE route as like, this is my escape hatch if I don't grow that fast. And now they're finding it's like, actually, the PEs don't care about you either."

Securing venture capital has never been harder for founders outside of the AI bubble, as Peter Walker states "it's definitely not the easiest time to raise money unless you are already in the legible cohort. And if you're in the legible cohort, you know who you are."

Rapid execution is replacing traditional product planning, with Peter Walker emphasizing that "the companies that are moving fast… don't know what they're doing in three weeks... we have no idea what's going to happen in October."

Artificial intelligence is fundamentally threatening traditional communication hierarchies, and Sam Jacobs is bearish on the future of people managers because "if the purpose of management is to facilitate decision making at certain executive levels, that is something that AI can do."

Connect with the Hosts & Guests 
Host: Sam Jacobs - https://www.linkedin.com/in/samfjacobs/ 
Host: AJ Bruno - https://www.linkedin.com/in/ajbruno3/ 
Host: Asad Zaman - https://www.linkedin.com/in/azaman1/ 
Guest: Peter Walker - https://www.linkedin.com/in/peterjameswalker/
 
Topline is more than a YouTube Channel!
Subscribe to Topline Newsletter: https://toplinemedia.substack.com/
Tune into Topline Podcast, the #1 podcast for founders, operators, and investors in B2B tech: https://www.joinpavilion.com/topline-podcast 
Join the free Topline Slack channel to connect with 600+ revenue leaders to keep the conversation going beyond the podcast: https://www.joinpavilion.com/topline-slack
Chapters: 
00:00 The AI Funding Divide 
02:36 Is It Harder to Raise Capital 
04:37 VCs Only Care About Growth 
06:44 The Death of the PE Exit 
10:48 Transitioning to AI Native 
14:50 Why Product Roadmaps Are (Kinda) Dead 
19:19 Stop Defaulting to VC 
29:11 Historic Tech Funding Rounds 
31:59 Over 530K Open Tech Jobs 
36:55 Hiring Market Concentration 
46:29 The Growing Tech Talent Divide 
49:11 VC Fund Performance Realities 
54:28 Future of Foundation Models 
58:29 The End of Middle Management

In this episode, Jordan Crawford outlines how revenue leaders can build an autonomous pipeline generation engine and transition away from static playbooks. The discussion covers practical methods for extracting competitor usage data, identifying segments of users who are far more likely to buy, and generally how top GTM teams are using GTM Engineering to dramatically improve their results. The hosts also evaluate how AI tools alter revenue operations, shift the traditional B2B SaaS go-to-market strategy, and force a total redesign of traditional AE compensation models.
Key Takeaways:
Top-down executive mandates fail because leadership lacks hands-on experience with the required technical systems. Jordan Crawford notes the absurdity of this disconnect, stating, "You read these letters from all these CEOs and they're like, 'We need to be an AI first organization and I can't tell you what that means or how to implement it, but goddamn, you need to be able to do it.'"
The core function of revenue operations must shift from administrative reporting tasks to running active market tests. Sam Jacobs explains this organizational friction, observing many Rev Ops employees think their job is still to deliver reports to the C-Suite and ensure data accuracy, when today's reality is that "actually your job now is to generate demand and like I need 50 campaigns tested by tomorrow."
Identifying high-value target accounts requires prioritizing product telemetry and user actions over static CRM fields. Jordan highlights the power of this approach, explaining that "AI can basically analyze customers' words, actions, and what's in the CRM and say... these accounts are worth 10 times more than these accounts."
Connect with the Hosts & Guests:
Host: Sam Jacobs - https://www.linkedin.com/in/samfjacobs/ 
Host: AJ Bruno - https://www.linkedin.com/in/ajbruno3/ 
Host: Asad Zaman - https://www.linkedin.com/in/azaman1/ 
Guest: Jordan Crawford - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jordancrawford/
Topline is more than a YouTube Channel:
Subscribe to Topline Newsletter: https://www.joinpavilion.com/topline-newsletter 
Tune into Topline Podcast, the #1 podcast for founders, operators, and investors in B2B tech: https://www.joinpavilion.com/topline-podcast J
Join the free Topline Slack channel to connect with 600+ revenue leaders to keep the conversation going beyond the podcast: https://www.joinpavilion.com/topline-slack
Chapters:
00:00 Podcast Episode Introduction 
02:52 Reversing GTM Strategy 
06:44 RevOps and AI Thought Partners 
13:58 Executing Fast Sales Campaigns 
18:25 AI For Comp Plan Benchmarks 
21:04 Defining Pain Qualified Segments 
26:42 Shifting RevOps Priorities 
38:41 Unbundling B2B SaaS Jobs 
39:21 The Topline Trivia Game 
45:11 Top Of Funnel AI Tactics 
46:43 Middle Of Funnel Telemetry 
47:56 Bottom Of Funnel Contract Review 
49:10 Bull/Bear Predictions