The Pilot Project Podcast

Every military aviator carries stories that stay with them long after the aircraft shuts down.
To mark the milestone of 100 episodes, we're looking back at the moments that revealed the true weight of military aviation. This second retrospective shifts from learning to fly to learning what comes after. A pilot's first time facing enemy fire, split-second decisions under pressure, devastating loss, the invisible burdens many carry home, and the resilience that keeps crews moving forward.
Featuring stories from fighter pilots, search and rescue crews, tactical helicopter crews, transport crews, and more, including the CF-18 Hornet, the CH-146 Griffon, and many other aircraft, this episode explores the realities of operational military aviation through the voices of those who lived it.
Whether you've been with us since Episode 1 or you're discovering The Pilot Project for the first time, The First 100 Series is the best place to start.
If you or someone you know is struggling, support is available. The Canadian Forces Member Assistance Program (CFMAP) provides confidential assistance to Canadian Armed Forces members, veterans, and their families. You can contact them at:
1-800-268-7708
https://www.canada.ca/en/department-national-defence/programs/member-assistance.html
CHAPTERS
(00:00:58) Introduction
(00:03:03) Act 1: Contact - Greg Juurlink - I was a brand new FO
(00:07:20) Eric Kenny - The missile exploded between us
(00:09:26) Troy Clarke - Is this what SAR is going to be?
(00:13:00) Anthony Dyer - My first CASEVAC ever
(00:14:50) Davis Clark - You don't know if it's a threat or not
(00:17:05) Act 2: The Line - Greg Juurlink - We got shot up
(00:23:00) Bob Wade - Escorting MiGs to Canada
(00:25:45) Dan McWilliams - Never fly into vortices
(00:28:40) Pete Wright & Greg Hudson - This is what we signed up for, let's go!
(00:30:39) Niels Olson - You don't know which way is up
(00:31:22) Dan McWilliams - Less than a wingspan above the ground
(00:32:12) Niels Olson - Certified Cocaine Boat!
(00:34:27) Bob Wade - One of you is going to die
(00:35:29) Act 3: The Ones We Lost - Greg Juurlink - Angel Flights in Afghanistan
(00:37:08) Vic Weston - Tom "Toast" McQueen
(00:40:38) Anthony Dyer - It's a smell you never forget
(00:41:43) Dan McWilliams - Timothy Kirk Leuty
(00:43:02) Rich MacDougall - Jenn Casey
(00:49:16) Mike Houle - Shattering Grief
(00:53:13) Act 4: The Burden - Greg Juurlink - A full bucket
(00:55:33) Bryan Morrison - I'm not OK
(00:58:45) Vic Weston - I'm not good to go
(00:59:58) Paul Goddard - You can't save everybody
(01:01:22) Dan McWilliams - Fears that last
(01:02:35) Lyndsay Olson - The Hardest Deployment
(01:04:41) Niels Olson - The Weight of Distance
(01:05:20) Janet Musters - Everything AND the Kitchen Sink
(01:06:36) Rich MacDougall - Your life has just changed forever
(01:08:59) Act 5: Blue Skies and the Way Forward - Bob Wade - A consequence of doing what you did
(01:10:03) Bryan Morrison - The value of my career vs everything else
(01:12:03) Anthony Dyer - Better or bitter
(01:13:45) Greg Juurlink - The most important thing is asking for help
(01:15:00) Bob Wade - I miss the boys
(01:15:52) Vic Weston - Honouring Tom "Toast" McQueen
(01:17:42) Rich MacDougall - She was a force to be reckoned with
(01:19:37) Paul Goddard - As good as it gets
(01:20:01) Mike Houle - Don't Hide the Pain
(01:20:26) Vic Weston - Keep movin' forward
(01:20:43) Outro and Special Thank You
CONTINUE THE FLIGHT
EXPLORE THE LOGBOOK
More stories from RCAF and mission aviation pilots

New listener? Start here!
For 100 episodes, The Pilot Project Podcast has explored the world of military and mission aviation through the people who have lived it.
In Part 1 of our retrospective series, The Climb, we look back at the making of military aviators.
From the first moments that sparked the dream, to the grind of training, the edge of high-performance flying, and the toll service can take even in peacetime, this episode traces the journey behind the wings.
These are the moments that shaped them, and the reasons they kept going.
CHAPTERS
(00:00:00) Intro/Cold open
(00:01:31) Act 1: The Spark - Dan McWilliams - First Fighter Flight
(00:03:09) Bob Wade - The Wonder of the Golden Hawks
(00:03:46) Mike Houle - Hercs Over the Lake
(00:05:05) Vince C-Benoit - Wheat Fields in Afghanistan
(00:05:57) Rock Veilleux - Gliding with Air Cadets
(00:08:44) Act 2: The Grind - Mike Houle - The Firehose
(00:09:58) Dan Conway - First Real Doubts
(00:10:11) Brian Kilroy - The Pressure Cooker
(00:13:38) Pete Musters - P is for Pilot
(00:14:17) Dan McWilliams - Owning Mistakes
(00:14:45) Jeff Foreman - Scale Change
(00:15:09) Dan McWilliams - Fighter Dreams Derailed
(00:17:57) Dan Conway - 98% Awesome
(00:18:55) Act 3: The Edge - Skye Simpson - The Imposter
(00:20:10) Bryan Morrison - The Culture Shock
(00:20:54) Ian Wookey - Realizing You're Terrible at Flying Helicopters
(00:22:26) Rock Veilleux - Flying the Hawk
(00:24:40) Brian Kilroy - The Edge of Capability
(00:28:52) Skye Simpson - A Stick of Gum
(00:30:39) Rock Veilleux - The Ejection
(00:39:16) Act 4: The Toll - Dan McWilliams - Twisted Bits of Aluminum
(00:40:17) Duncan MacIsaac - How Many Lives Did They Save?
(00:41:48) Dan McWilliams - BAM! It Was Over.
(00:43:25) Bob Wade - The Weight of Instructing
(00:44:16) Rock Veilleux - The Road to Recovery
(00:48:34) CFMAP Information
(00:48:59) Act 5: Why We Fly - Blake McNaughton - Brothers and Sisters
(00:49:56) Rich MacDougall - Most Memorable Flight
(00:50:52) Jeff Foreman - This Is Your Captain Speaking
(00:51:28) Rich MacDougall - 25 Years Ago, That Was Me
(00:52:03) Blake McNaughton - A Gig Like Nothing Else

Retired Lieutenant-Colonel Maryse Carmichael returns to discuss the Snowbirds, the retirement of the CT-114 Tutor, the planned operational pause, and the future of one of Canada’s most recognizable aviation teams.
In Part 2 of this conversation, Maryse explains what Canadians do not see behind a Snowbirds performance, from months of training and preparation to the trust, discipline, teamwork, and safety culture required to fly nine aircraft in close formation. She also shares powerful stories about the team's impact, including how one airshow inspired a future Snowbirds pilot.
Drawing on her experience as both a Snowbirds pilot and former Commanding Officer, Maryse reflects on the team's legacy, the risks of losing hard-earned expertise, and what she hopes the next generation of Snowbirds pilots will inherit.
CHAPTERS
(00:00:00) Introduction and Episode Overview
(00:01:01) The Hidden Work Behind a Snowbirds Airshow
(00:06:13) Flying a First Snowbirds Show in Quebec City
(00:09:32) Common Misconceptions About the Snowbirds Demonstration Team
(00:12:26) Training for Emergencies in a Nine-Jet Snowbirds Formation
(00:14:16) How Snowbirds Prepare for Emergencies Before Every Flight
(00:15:00) The Snowbirds Mission: Inspiration, Recruitment, and Public Engagement
(00:16:04) Inspiring the Next Generation of Canadian Military Pilots
(00:17:01) Why the Snowbirds Still Matter After 55 Years
(00:17:56) What Makes a Great Snowbird Pilot?
(00:19:12) How Pilots Are Assigned Their Snowbirds Positions
(00:20:28) How Long It Takes to Build a Snowbird Pilot
(00:21:07) The Hardest Skills to Teach a Snowbird Pilot
(00:24:47) How Trust Is Built Inside the Snowbirds
(00:27:08) Balancing Safety and Spectacle in an Air Demonstration Team
(00:28:51) The Story Behind the Snowbirds Heart Maneuver
(00:29:44) What Keeps a Snowbirds Commanding Officer Awake at Night
(00:33:29) Why the CT-114 Tutor Was the Perfect Demonstration Aircraft
(00:34:31) Did Anyone Expect the CT-114 Tutor to Fly for 63 Years?
(00:35:38) Saying Goodbye to the CT-114 Tutor
(00:37:31) What Canadians Underestimate About the CT-157 Siskin Transition
(00:39:10) Lessons from the Red Arrows and Other Aerobatic Teams
(00:41:19) The Strongest Argument for a Snowbirds Pause
(00:43:25) What Canada Risks Losing During the Snowbirds Pause
(00:45:51) The Hardest Snowbirds Skills to Rebuild
(00:48:58) What Concerns Snowbirds Alumni Most
(00:49:33) What the Snowbirds Alumni Association Wants to See Happen
(00:54:24) What the Snowbirds Mean to Maryse Carmichael
(00:55:18) What Canadians Should See in Nine Red and White Aircraft
(00:55:38) The Legacy Maryse Carmichael Hopes the Next Snowbirds Inherit
CONTINUE THE FLIGHT
Maryse’s story begins in Part 1, where she discusses flying the CT-114 Tutor, becoming the first female jet demonstration pilot, and her path to the Snowbirds.
Snowbirds: The Pause Part 1: Flying the CT-114 Tutor and Becoming the First Female Jet Demonstration Pilot - Maryse Carmichael
Maryse mentioned our interview with Comd RCAF, Jamie Speiser-Blanchet
Command: The Future Force: Building a Fifth Generation Air Force - Jamie Speiser-Blanchet

Maryse also discusses the challenge of preserving specialized aviation expertise during transition, a theme we explored in our SEEDCORN series.
Long Range Patrol: The P-8 SEEDCORN Part 1
Long Range Patrol: The P-8 SEEDCORN Part 2

MORE SNOWBIRDS EPISODES
More Snowbirds episodes

EXPLORE THE LOGBOOK
More stories from RCAF and mission aviation pilots

Before she commanded the Snowbirds, Maryse Carmichael was a young Air Cadet from Quebec City with a dream of becoming a military pilot. That dream would eventually make her the first woman to fly with the Snowbirds - and the first woman to fly with any jet aerobatic demonstration team in the world.
In Part 1, Maryse shares her journey through Air Cadets, flight training in Moose Jaw, instructional flying on the CT-114 Tutor, operational flying with 434 Squadron, VIP operations with 412 Squadron, and serving in Bagotville during the post-9/11 years. Along the way she discusses Exercise RV92, flying with her brother, supporting the Prime Minister, and the experiences that shaped her leadership philosophy.

Maryse also reflects on earning a position with the Snowbirds, learning precision formation aerobatics, flying formation inverted, and eventually returning to command 431 Air Demonstration Squadron. It is a story of perseverance, trust, leadership, and one of the most remarkable careers in Canadian military aviation.
CONTINUE THE FLIGHT
Maryse mentioned our interview with Jamie Speiser-Blanchet. Check it out:
https://podpilotproject.transistor.fm/episodes/command-the-future-force-jamie-speiser-blanchet
If you're interested in another Snowbirds perspective, check out our interview with Blake McNaughton:
https://podpilotproject.transistor.fm/episodes/snowbirds-the-unexpected-path-blake-mcnaughton
HEAR MORE SNOWBIRDS EPISODES
https://podpilotproject.transistor.fm/search?query=snowbirds
EXPLORE THE LOGBOOK
More stories from RCAF and mission aviation pilots
https://podpilotproject.transistor.fm/episodes

In Part 3, Captain Troy Clarke discusses flight instruction, standards flying, STARS Air Ambulance operations, and his decision to return to the RCAF after leaving military service.