The Premed Years

(00:00) — Welcome and origin story: Kyle’s path into med ed without being a physician
(00:46) — Early admissions work and philosophy: get students into—and out of—med school
(02:58) — What AACOM’s VP of UME Services does: support across 71 DO locations
(04:48) — Admitted-to-M1 is hard: student services and reps supporting the transition
(05:12) — Time in the DO space: Marian start and osteopathic focus since 2018
(06:38) — Biggest shift: single match and what’s improved (and what hasn’t)
(10:07) — USMLE vs COMLEX: bias, requirements, and what applicants should weigh
(12:33) — Data points: general surgery study, plus primary care ~55% context
(16:51) — Advocacy update: the FAIR Act and reporting for federally funded programs
(20:17) — The DO deposit debate: amounts, rationale, and potential changes
(25:32) — Should you apply to DO schools? Choose by fit, curriculum, and support
(31:01) — AACOMAS streamlining: 700-character experiences and tech to cut tedium
(33:56) — Personal statements: copy/paste and when to add DO-specific experience
(38:03) — Financial aid shift: Grad PLUS elimination and new student resources
(40:19) — School-backed loans and lender partnerships: protecting students
(43:40) — Final takeaways: faculty support, fit, and thriving as a DO or MD
Dr. Ryan Gray welcomes Kyle Hattenberg, AACOM’s VP of Undergraduate Medical Education Services, for a practical look at DO admissions, advocacy, and student support. Kyle explains his new role supporting 71 osteopathic locations, including work on AACOMAS and student services to smooth the admitted-to-M1 transition. They unpack the single match era, persistent USMLE/COMLEX bias, and how AACOM is pushing for equal consideration—highlighting the FAIR Act, which would require federally funded programs to report on accepting and reviewing both DO and MD applicants.
They tackle hot-button issues like nonrefundable deposits ($1,500–$3,000), why schools use them, and ongoing conversations about change—plus Kyle’s advice to contact schools for hardship considerations. Kyle previews AACOMAS streamlining, including aligning the experience section to 700 characters and leveraging technology to reduce tedious data entry. He clarifies personal statement strategy and when DO-specific experiences belong. Finally, they address the elimination of the Grad PLUS loan, with AACOM building financial wellness resources, hiring dedicated support, and exploring partnerships, while noting that some schools already offer school-backed loans. The episode closes with guidance to choose schools based on fit, curriculum, and support—because thriving in medical school comes first.

What You'll Learn:
- How AACOM supports applicants and 71 osteopathic locations
- What the single match means for DOs and where bias persists
- FAIR Act goals and what programs may need to report
- Upcoming AACOMAS tweaks, including 700-character activities
- Deposit realities, Grad PLUS changes, and funding options

(00:00) — Late to medicine: Chris didn’t consider being a doctor until college, shaped by early family experiences with inadequate care.
(01:20) — Struggling student to UC Davis: He describes a nontraditional path and surprise at earning a single college acceptance.
(02:50) — “You won’t amount to much”: A sixth-grade dismissal and falling in with the wrong crowd set the stage.
(04:40) — Misdiagnosed and othered: Labeled with severe ADD, placed in special education, later correctly diagnosed with a comprehension disability.
(06:25) — Not going the other way: He credits his mother’s advocacy and a teacher, Mr. Russell, for keeping him engaged.
(09:00) — College reset and new peers: A friend shares MD-PhD resources and expands his horizon.
(10:35) — Outreach program to research home: A scholars program places him in a lab with a PI for four formative years.
(11:50) — On DEI and mentors: He reflects on access programs and the impact of Dr. Connie Champagne.
(13:50) — First OR spark: Shadowing an orthopedic surgeon shows him the excitement of patient care beyond pipetting.
(15:40) — Sustaining motivation: Reframing medicine as a currency for service and asking who do I want to be?
(17:50) — Community and advocacy: He discusses serving Indigenous communities and advocating on the Hill for GME in Indian country.
(20:50) — Crafting the Why: How deep reflection and post-it mapping shaped his personal statement.
(21:55) — Why MD-PhD: An MD-PI at a summer program shows how medical training sharpens research questions.
(23:30) — First interview relief: Landing an invite during the COVID cycle felt like validation.
(24:45) — Strategy and scope: 23 applications, West Coast focus, MSTP and non-MSTP programs.
(26:00) — Coherence wins: A clear why plus tangible research output made his application click.
(27:45) — Multiple acceptances: He recalls the emotions of earning 9–10 offers.
(28:40) — To students doubting themselves: Separate self-worth from others’ opinions and keep going.
(31:20) — What’s next: Interest in dermatology residency and leading a lab studying skin disease mechanisms.
Chris never planned on medicine. Growing up in Southern California, he saw family members with preventable disease go uncared for, struggled in school, and was misdiagnosed with severe ADD in middle school before a later diagnosis of a comprehension disability. After being told in sixth grade he wouldn’t amount to much, a continuation school, his mother’s advocacy, and a teacher’s attention kept him afloat.
At UC Davis, an outreach email changed everything, placing him in a lab for four years and opening the door to both science and medicine. A friend introduced him to MD-PhD resources, and shadowing an orthopedic surgeon turned interest into excitement. Chris shares how he built an enduring motivation by reframing medicine as a currency for service, with a commitment to community, including Indigenous communities.

He breaks down the hardest premed task—articulating Why Medicine—and the post-it exercise that helped him find a coherent thread. Applying during the first COVID cycle, he earned 16 interview invites and 9–10 acceptances by presenting a clear why and tangible research work. We also discuss advocacy for more GME positions in Indian country and his interest in dermatology and leading a lab.

If you’ve ever been told you won’t make it, this conversation offers practical ways to keep going.

What You'll Learn:
- How a misdiagnosis and school setbacks were addressed and reframed
- Ways to access research and mentorship through outreach programs
- A practical method to build a coherent Why Medicine
- What made his MD-PhD application make sense and earn 16 interviews
- Using community and advocacy to sustain motivation

(00:00) — Opening + Early Spark: PBS Nova lights up neuroscience and a reluctant interest in medicine.
(01:11) — Family Expectations vs Autonomy: Pressure from a physician dad meets teenage rebellion.
(02:38) — Why the Brain: Linking biology to behavior and people.
(03:51) — MD vs PhD: Lab work that kept pointing back to patients.
(05:19) — Learning the Process: What help a physician parent could and couldn’t give.
(06:54) — College Uncertainty: Pre-reqs without a clear why.
(08:12) — OChem Walls: A D, COVID retake, and imposter syndrome.
(10:16) — Asking for Help: An advisor’s belief and an ADHD nudge.
(12:46) — Retaking Again: Why OChem came back during the gap year.
(13:39) — Owning It in Interviews: Explaining GPA discrepancies.
(16:03) — Finding the Why in Clinic: Psychometrist work reframes the grind.
(18:06) — Gap Years Multiply: Burnout, scribing, and a reset on plans.
(20:03) — MCAT Long Game: Planning pitfalls and voiding the first test.
(24:16) — Treat the Test Taker: Support, therapy, and ADHD/anxiety diagnosis.
(27:02) — Accommodations Talk: The policy gap that hurts late-diagnosed students.
(31:16) — Secondaries Crunch: No prewriting, 50 schools, heavy lift.
(33:06) — First Interview Joy: Late-cycle invitations and renewed hope.
(36:11) — Enjoying Interviews: Validation, calm, and showing up as yourself.
(37:36) — First Acceptance Jitters: Legacy doubt and social media nuance.
(39:42) — Choosing a School: In-state fit, family proximity, and finances.
(41:03) — Med School Life: Hard and fun, community and decompression.
(42:50) — Make the Time: Gym, therapy, friends, and sustainable studying.
(43:24) — Final Encouragement: If it’s meant for you, adjust and keep going.
Chauncella shares how a middle-school fascination with neuroscience grew into a conviction to practice medicine—despite family pressure, self-doubt, and some very real hurdles. We dig into an OChem D, retakes across COVID, and the imposter syndrome that kept Chauncella from asking for help. A supportive advisor opened the door to evaluate ADHD, and during gap years Chauncella’s psychometrist role made the patient impact feel undeniable. The MCAT became another turning point: inconsistent planning, test-day anxiety, and ultimately voiding the first attempt led to addressing mental health, receiving ADHD/anxiety diagnoses, and finally moving forward with clarity. Chauncella applied once to about 50 schools without prewriting secondaries, still earning seven interviews—many later in the cycle than expected—and learning to enjoy the process. The first acceptance brought complex “legacy” feelings, but subsequent offers and an in-state choice close to family brought confidence and fit. Now in pre-clinicals, Chauncella prioritizes balance—making time for the gym, therapy, and friends—to sustain the work. This conversation offers practical takeaways on asking for help, reframing setbacks, navigating timelines, and holding onto your why.

What You'll Learn:
- How to turn OChem setbacks and an MCAT void into momentum
- Why addressing ADHD/anxiety can change your study and test strategy
- Using gap years for clinical clarity and strengthening your application
- Approaching interviews with calm, authenticity, and confidence
- Choosing a school with fit, proximity, and finances in mind

(00:00) — Getting started: Early interest and a high school health pathway with real certifications
(01:35) — Small border town roots: Del Rio, one high school, and limited options
(02:35) — Finding a “seed”: Family illness, cancer curiosity, and early research
(03:40) — Choosing a college: Looking for rigor, research, and premed support
(05:54) — Where guidance came from: Personal research and professional advising
(07:35) — Plugging in: Using a premed society to meet advisors and med schools
(08:18) — Competition culture: Staying in your lane amid big‑school premed vibes
(10:13) — Toughest premed shift: Independence, rigor, and learning to use office hours
(11:24) — College to med school: Fire‑hydrant learning and lingering imposter syndrome
(13:15) — Asking for help earlier: Seeing peers model it and dropping the pride
(13:55) — Biggest time waste: Grind culture and recopying notes vs smarter study
(15:15) — How hard to push: Pulling back without tanking performance and pressure talk
(19:00) — Pomodoro explained: Focus blocks, real breaks, and building stamina
(21:10) — Study tools: Anki, YouTube resources, and iPad drawings for anatomy
(22:40) — Sciences reality: Hating Gen Chem, loving visual organic chemistry
(25:06) — Getting through hard prereqs: Treating them as a rite of passage
(26:00) — App strategy: Using campus visits to set the bar and plan experiences
(27:10) — Interviews: First invite joy, MMI’s lack of feedback, and virtual hiccups
(30:27) — Acceptance: Texas pre‑match call and the relief of a safety net
(31:58) — No backup plan: Optimism, gap‑years okay, but eyes on the prize
(33:30) — Support in med school: Family, friends, and “trauma bonding” with classmates
(34:19) — Hardest part: Setbacks and remembering your why
(35:10) — Most surprising: Intensity you can’t grasp until you’re in it
(35:49) — Final advice: Return to your why and stop comparing
Kaylah, a fourth-year medical student, traces her path from a small border town in Del Rio, Texas to medical school by leaning into curiosity, community, and smarter studying. In high school, a career and technical education program let her earn healthcare certifications that sparked real clinical interest. As an undergrad at Texas A&M, she sought academic rigor and built-in research while learning to ask for help sooner—through office hours, professional advising, and a premed society that brought advisors and medical schools to campus.
She shares the toughest moments too: a rocky transition to college, being humbled by General Chemistry (but loving visual organic chemistry), and navigating a competitive premed culture by staying in her own lane. Inside medical school, she talks imposter syndrome, the fire‑hydrant pace of learning, and how Pomodoro, Anki, and visual tools on her iPad kept her grounded. She opens up about the stress of MMIs and virtual glitches, the relief of a Texas pre‑match call after three interviews, and the power of friends and family when things get heavy.
If you’re weighing how hard to push versus how smart to study, or how to keep your “why” front and center, Kaylah’s candid reflections will help you recalibrate.

What You'll Learn:
- How to plug into advising and support even at large schools
- Ways to manage competition by staying in your lane
- Smarter study methods: Pomodoro, Anki, and visual learning
- Handling MMIs when there’s no feedback or affirmation
- Keeping your why alive through setbacks and intensity

(00:00) — Curiosity in the halls of Mass General: Her mom’s triple‑negative breast cancer and remission shape an early interest in medicine.
(02:54) — Choosing a major without a premed major: From biochemistry to discovering neuroscience and why UMass ultimately fit.
(06:04) — Double majoring without burning out: Overlap with prereqs, honest advising on dual degrees, and following interests.
(09:13) — Make advising work for you: Meeting early, becoming a peer advisor, and hearing hard feedback you don’t want to hear.
(12:56) — Rethinking gap years: Fears about money give way to growth, responsibility, and better prep for med school.
(17:23) — What went wrong on the first MCAT: Cramming, no plan, and taking it during senior year.
(19:33) — The retake that worked: Six months, 3 hours a day, weekly full-lengths, and using AAMC practice tests.
(22:52) — Lining up letters after graduation: Staying in touch with advisors and professors, and using undergrad resources.
(25:34) — Clinical path: EMT to pediatric ER clinical assistant: Building skills during COVID, behavioral health work, and a role that cemented medicine.
(32:05) — The application surprise: Not prewriting secondaries—and why she won’t skip that again.
(33:43) — First interview jitters and prep: Early invites, mock interviews, and centering fit.
(35:52) — Eight interview invites: Why authenticity and geography beat obsessing over stats.
(40:33) — Toughest interview prompt: Answering “Tell me about yourself” and a bartender curveball.
(44:10) — The first acceptance: A full-circle moment at work and calling mom.
(45:40) — Final advice to premeds: Keep an open mind—and be kind to yourself.
Today’s guest traces a clear, practical path from childhood curiosity in the halls of Mass General—while her mom underwent treatment and later entered remission—to a medical school seat built on consistency, flexibility, and honest self-reflection. She shares how starting at UMass in biochemistry, discovering neuroscience, and building an early relationship with her premed advisor shaped smarter decisions—like delaying the MCAT and embracing gap years she once feared.

We dive into the first MCAT attempt that fell flat (no schedule, cramming during senior year, few practice tests) and the 15‑point turnaround that followed: six months post‑graduation, three hours a day, AAMC full‑lengths every Thursday, and a real study plan. She details lining up letters before leaving campus, keeping in touch after graduation, and why not prewriting secondaries became her biggest application headache.

Clinically, she moved from EMT certification and campus EMS to behavioral health sitting and a clinical assistant role in a pediatric ER—experiences that cemented her desire to practice. Finally, we cover interviews (including a surprise bartender question), eight invites, the first acceptance at work, and her closing advice: keep an open mind—and be kind to yourself.

What You'll Learn:
- How to build a productive relationship with your premed advisor
- A realistic MCAT retake plan: pacing, practice tests, and scheduling
- Why gap years and nonclinical jobs can strengthen your application
- Finding schools by fit and mission instead of fixating on stats
- Timing letters and prewriting secondaries to avoid bottlenecks